Is Online Poker Rigged? Poker — 20 October 2005

My soon to be co-worker, Ephro, sent me the following that he lifted from an un-named message board (I assume):

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arrow 3 PokerTracker Is Rigged!

I hear many people talk about “Poker Tracker” program (or other similar type programs), who’s to say that these programs are not also set up so that they dont show any thing is wrong. It’s all programing and anything can be done with programing.

If these sites are making HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS from rigged sites wouldnt they invest some of this into a dumby software company/s and write a program/s that checks for adnormalities in hands then have these hands check out as being OK.

Do you know for sure that the programs you use to check the programs you use are not fixed just like the program your trying to check to see if it’s fixed or not.

Something tells me that this guy makes a lot of phone calls to government agencies regarding black helicopters and secret messages being beamed into his head by spy satellites. It think there’s an interesting angle on people who think like this. I mean, this guy is so convinced that the reason he’s a losing player is because there’s a world-wide conspiracy to thrwart him, that it’s pointless to even attempt a rational discussion. If you released the source code for PokerTracker he would claim that the guys who wrote C++ (assuming that’s what PokerTracker is written in) put in traps so that if/then signaled the compiler to insert instructions that would make normal source code hide abnormalities. Hell, Intel might as well be in on it too. Maybe their chips are designed to perform some special math routine whenever they’re presented with calculations that would implicate online poker rooms in cheating.

More Rigged Goodness:

Proof That Online Poker Is Rigged!
Why Online Poker Is Not Rigged
Online Poker Not Rigged – Revisted
If online poker is rigged, why do you continue to play?

 PokerTracker Is Rigged!

About

Bill Rini has been working in the online poker industry since 2004. He was a product manager for poker at Full Tilt and was the poker room manager at PartyPoker. Currently, Bill is the Head of Online Poker for WSOP.

 

Bill has been blogging about online poker since 2003 and is considered one of the leading authorities on the online poker industry.

 

“I like What Bill Rini said in his blog” – Doyle Brunson

 

“In other news, we had Bill Rini write an absolutely home run blog.” Daniel Negreanu

 

“Industry insider Bill Rini has one of the most popular blogs in poker, with thousands of subscribers and fans regularly coming back for his universally respected insight into the industry” – Barry Carter (News editor for PokerStrategy, Co-Author: The Mental Game of Poker)

Ship It Holla Ballas!

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About Author

Bill Rini has been working in the online poker industry since 2004. He was a product manager for poker at Full Tilt and was the poker room manager at PartyPoker. Currently, Bill is the Head of Online Poker for WSOP.

 

Bill has been blogging about online poker since 2003 and is considered one of the leading authorities on the online poker industry.

 

“I like What Bill Rini said in his blog” – Doyle Brunson

 

“In other news, we had Bill Rini write an absolutely home run blog.” Daniel Negreanu

 

“Industry insider Bill Rini has one of the most popular blogs in poker, with thousands of subscribers and fans regularly coming back for his universally respected insight into the industry” – Barry Carter (News editor for PokerStrategy, Co-Author: The Mental Game of Poker)

(21) Readers Comments

  1. It seemed that there were WAY too many suck-outs on Full Tilt. I left to play at WPT for months where it seemed very normal – no more suck-outs than real-life play. On my first day back to Full Tilt, it’s almost like i’m flagged and they’re trying to prove a point – which i doubt since there are millions of players but it might take just one second to click a user into f-with-him mode. It’s almost like EVERY hand ends in a bad beat. There’s no way i’m imagining this. Whether I’m flagged or not, everyone at the table can see the bad beats.

  2. In response to the original article:

    Poker Tracker statistics say nothing about whether or not an online poker site is rigged or not. In other words, it could be rigged or not, and the Poker Tracker statistics would still be the same. Let me explain.

    The chance of getting aces would still show (in Poker Tracker) to be 220:1 but this doesn’t mean it’s not rigged, because this is an AVERAGE OVERALL STATISTIC FOR ALL PLAYERS. IT SAYS NOTHING ABOUT HOW OFTEN ACES GET CRACKED, IT JUST TELLS US HOW OFTEN ACES ARE DEALT. Does Poker Tracker tell us how often the good players loose with aces? NO. Does poker tracker tell us how often a good player loses with a set to runner runner straights? NO. Instances are recorded but there is no way to group those instances. End of story.

    The only way to really tell if a really good player is losing because of “rigged” handicaps is to take a very large sample, at least 50,000 hands, and track their success. So if they are winning at first and suddenly encounter 3 months of bad beats, and their VPIP% PFR and AF suggest they are still a winning player at their stakes, then there is some good evidence that online poker is rigged. The thing is, people rarely use this kind of evidence in their argument that poker is not rigged.

  3. Hand histories, please.

  4. I was in a tourney yesterday at 2 tables, I had 2 straight flushes, saw another 2. 2 were mine, one was against me where i had a 3rd open end str8 flush on flop, hit my flush on the river, but lost to the guy who had the gutshot str8 flush, and hit it on river. 4th one one guy flopped quads, and lost to runner runner 4 card str8 flush. Sorry but that ain’t random. I shouldn’t see this kinda stuff but once in a blue moon, but I see it every day on Pokerstars

  5. I was in a tourney yesterday at 2 tables, I had 2 straight flushes, saw another 2. 2 were mine, one was against me where i had a 3rd open end str8 flush on flop, hit my flush on the river, but lost to the guy who had the gutshot str8 flush, and hit it on river. 4th one one guy flopped quads, and lost to runner runner 4 card str8 flush. Sorry but that ain’t random. I shouldn’t see this kinda stuff but once in a blue moon, but I see it every day on Pokerstars

  6. I know for a fact that the pokerstars shuffling algorithm is just as random if not more random than the best shuffler in vegas. The problem is, provisional poker players are becoming ‘spoiled’ with the flood of poker helper programs that they just about cant breathe without them. Think of it this way also, if those programs worked so well, then why do the programmers have to charge, for them? Dont they make enough money with them?

    Doesnt anyone remember the school years when the math teachers would take all calculators away before testing?

    You have to trust your gut instincts, add those odds and outs in your head become a human calculator its not hard.

    The more you do it the easier. To be honest, I’d much rather play agianst a cheap program then I would a seasoned poker professional who has the true nutz.

  7. I agree with what I read earlier, if u think the site is rigged do not play on it.. I am pretty sure that the only people who are complaining about it being rigged are the ones who are not good at poker. Im sure if they go to a real casino they will do know better…. Make a long story short, LOSERS QUIT WHINING and read a book and when u start to win maybe u wont believe the sight is rigged…. I have played poker for years and I see no difference between online and real poker…

  8. haha you guys are funny

  9. I won with a 9 high flush, not 2 pair because the 4th club gave it to me

  10. I won with a 9 high flush, not 2 pair because the 4th club gave it to me

  11. Dont worry about it,

    I agree 100% with you actually…Im skeptical for most things, and I play online poker and actually win consistently, maybe not as much as other people, but maybe 40-80$ a day. But anytime that you have money and the internet mixing, you can’t rule out for a second that things are fixed, and I don’t know how people can defend these offshore sites that have no rules or regulations.

    aim name is “xiiislipknotiiix”

    Thanks

  12. Hello….!!! MCFLY!!!!

    If online poker is so random.. why is it so easy for people to predict what’s going to happen by the flop as in a real hand earlier tonigh… For instance if i hold (5)(8) off suit, and I flop two pair.. with no pair on the board.. its nearly guranteed there’s going to be a staight and or flush draw.. on the flop 568 with 2 clubs. at this point i already can predict a 4th card to the str8 is coming… and so of course it does … 9 of clubs. so now theres a flush draw and a 4 cards to the str8? so whats the river… you guessed King of clubs… so 4 to the str8 and 4 to the flush… the occurence of this in online poker is so frequent its ludicrous and thats why 2 pair hardly ever wins.. My hand held up but get real about the 4 to the flush and 4 to the str8.. espcially if you have 2 pair… 8 times out of 10 if u have KK never move all in… You almost always get called by Ace anything and the ace of course shows up at least 8 times out of 10. For you drones mindlessly defending these online poker sites… You need to get a clue… and I don’t doubt pokertracker is rigged for a second. Also never try to trap in online poker because every time u try and some clown moves all in with the worst hand and u call knowing u r dominating.. they miraculously outdraw u 8 times out of 10. Peace!

  13. Hello….!!! MCFLY!!!!

    If online poker is so random.. why is it so easy for people to predict what’s going to happen by the flop as in a real hand earlier tonigh… For instance if i hold (5)(8) off suit, and I flop two pair.. with no pair on the board.. its nearly guranteed there’s going to be a staight and or flush draw.. on the flop 568 with 2 clubs. at this point i already can predict a 4th card to the str8 is coming… and so of course it does … 9 of clubs. so now theres a flush draw and a 4 cards to the str8? so whats the river… you guessed King of clubs… so 4 to the str8 and 4 to the flush… the occurence of this in online poker is so frequent its ludicrous and thats why 2 pair hardly ever wins.. My hand held up but get real about the 4 to the flush and 4 to the str8.. espcially if you have 2 pair… 8 times out of 10 if u have KK never move all in… You almost always get called by Ace anything and the ace of course shows up at least 8 times out of 10. For you drones mindlessly defending these online poker sites… You need to get a clue… and I don’t doubt pokertracker is rigged for a second. Also never try to trap in online poker because every time u try and some clown moves all in with the worst hand and u call knowing u r dominating.. they miraculously outdraw u 8 times out of 10. Peace!

  14. I’m gonna make a new poker site. It’s gonna be great. The best hand will NEVER EVER lose. Of course to do this, I’ll have to rig the rng…

  15. Morons will be morons. Thanks for the “absolute proof.”

  16. Kings crack aces once and you think that’s “absolutle”?

    I’m pissed you made me go read that, you moron.

  17. Funny you should mention online poker being rigged, I posted the absolutle proof on 2+2

    http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Number=3717942&page=8&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=14&fpart=1

  18. And here I thought all along that it was all started with JFK.

  19. Somehow it all comes back to “Catcher in the Rye.”

  20. You are SO naive if you think this stops with Intel. Intel just makes the chips–they’re just a pawn. No, it’s the producers of silicon, THEY are the invisible and malevolent hand that dictates the course of our lives. Every time I walk along the beach, and hear the sound of the sand crunching beneath my feet…its the sound of these evil forces stepping on a million human throats.

  21. That’s the beauty of the true conspiracy theory: proof (or tools to obtain proof) to debunk it is further evidence of the conspiracy’s strength itself.

    Of course, to paraphrase loosely Karl Popper, a theory that cannot be proven false is pretty much bullshit.

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